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Soundcard advice needed.

ChillinBuzz	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 11:03 AM Gonna keep this dead simple: I recently got an old Fostex XR-7 cassette multitracker, mostly for mixing my old 90s mastertapes and partly for the joy of analog recording. The XR-7 has a very good range of features, one of which being 4 aux outputs direct from the tape (one aux socket for each track). As I don't have a soundcard capable of accepting 4 inputs (aux or 1/4" jack) and running 2 soundcards, however possible, is impractical, I've decided to purchase a new soundcard to achieve this goal. I run a dual core PC with more than enough juice to handle anything I throw at it. Has anyone got any suggestions on a suitable soundcard with 4 or 8 inputs (aux or 1/4" jack), preferably using a loom supplied, that I can connect to the XR-7's four aux outputs. Also, what multitrack software exists that can record more than 2 inputs at a time? Not bothered if it's PCI, PCI-E, USB 2.0 or Firewire, as long as it has at least 4 inputs and can record all 4 at the same time. Soundforge 6 and the onboard audio's line in socket just don't cut it.
LiQuidMetamo...	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 12:07 PM If you want to invest in great quality that'll see you through a few years, then you need to splash a little bit of cash, these babies are great audio interfaces. http://www.rme-audio.de/en_products_multiface_2.php depending on budget and needs... http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/828 http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/ultralite/ e-mu 1616 in whichever configuration suits best... http://www.emu.com/products/welcome.asp?category=505 a slightly lower budget option would be the M-Audio Delta 66 - it is less future proof, has fewer inputs (but enough for 4 ins) and it's converters are not as good as the ones above but still much better than the average audio card. http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta66-main.html Btw - check what firewire chipset your computer is running, firewire performance on PCs is really variable, texas instruments and toshiba chipsets seem to work well, the rest suck ball$. Firewire is way more consistent on a mac (as they only use 1 type of texas instruments chipset) so you might want to consider pci/pcie or usb 2.0 before firewire. The MOTU 828 is available as a usb 2.0 interface or firewire, incidentally.
LiQuidMetamo...	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 12:17 PM oh btw, I didn't see that you needed 8x trs input including the aux outputs. So that rules out the delta 66 and emu (4 trs inputs and 2 xlr) and the motu ultralite (that has 6 trs inputs but you could maybe convert 2 to xlr and make it work with adapters/di boxes). Of course, the cost of the audio cards with 8 trs io jacks may be a bit prohibitive. You could always consider a 4 input choice and do all your effect processing through your computer DAW and all of those audio cards come equipped with some lite DAW application such as Cubase LE, Sonar LE, Live Lite, etc which have FX plugins included.
ChillinBuzz	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 12:21 PM I liked the look of that Multiface II but noticed the PCI cards are an optional extra... So that's outta my price range. Pity, really... Forget that, anyway... I just saw the 828 & UltraLite... 6x 1/4" jack inputs (just gotta get aux to 1/4" jack leads) AND it has a MIDI controller in it (which my onboard soundcard doesn't supply a socket for)... And all this going into Firewire... Tidy. Thanks! Firewire: Texas Instruments OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller. Never really taken much notice, it's just this pc is the first one I've built that's had two Firewire ports added alongside the 10 USB 2.0 ports. Not that I had a use for that many either. Now, for software to record this many tracks at once...
ChillinBuzz	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 12:28 PM was writing that as you added. converting auxiliary to 1/4" jack is easy, i usually use some of the many adapters i've collected over the years but for this particular setup i will buy dedicated cabling to reduce any noise/interference. 4 is a must, so the Ultralite is right up my street. The XR-7 can actually handle up to 8 outs, albeit really fiddly by using the stereo, monitor and tape aux outputs. It does have 6 channels so that would tie in nicely with the Ultralite. Would probably go for the USB2 version although having Firewire would be nice if I was ever to use it on a Mac.... Decisions... I do have a budget, lqm, however the Ultralite could well fit my needs enough to warrant a purchase. The computer can do all the hard work, to start with all this interface needs to do is hook the Fostex's 4 tape aux outputs to the pc and let me record all 4 at the same time into a multitrack app, so I can keep it all in sync and remaster the tracks better. After that, I have plans involving MIDI, possible live and demo recording, which it also fits into. Thanks
LiQuidMetamo...	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 12:36 PM The ultralite is a great interface but is firewire only, but Texas Instruments chipsets (like yours) usually work well and if yours is a 6 pin it allows it to be powered through the firewire buss, as opposed to the 4 pin firewire found on most pc laptops. The added benefit of an ultralite is that if you get a laptop, it's a great portable device. I know lots of people using Motu 828 mk2s and ultralites, they have a lot of positive stuff to say about them. Good Luck with your new setup, that should keep you entertained for a good little while !
LiQuidMetamo...	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 12:46 PM The software that comes bundled with the audio cards should be able to handle recording 6 tracks individually. Definately Cubase LE or Sonar LE can handle it, you'll need to configure the preferences at the start so that your software sees the hardware and configures it correctly, this may be done in the software that comes with the audio card or need manual attention, in Cubase you press f12 and go to the audiobay to set up multiple inputs and then you choose each input/output on each track's channel strip. These versions are cut down, but can still handle multiple ins and outs. They cut down on stuff such as track count usually 48 as opposed to unlimited, plugins (and take out the best reverbs usually), MIDI scoring, virtual instruments and then stuff like offline processing (process fx offline to save having to run another insert/send in realtime, therefore less CPU consumed) and plugin delay compensation (may need you to adjust latency settings higher when mixing down) but the major functionality of the program remains.
ChillinBuzz	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 1:08 PM Hmm, 6 pin or 4 pin Firewire... I'm assuming the 6 pin variation is the larger socket (somewhat deeper than a USB socket) whilst the 4 pin socket is that tiddly little evil thing on laptops. If so, I have two 6 pins. Of course, the cost of the audio cards with 8 trs io jacks may be a bit prohibitive. You could always consider a 4 input choice and do all your effect processing through your computer DAW and all of those audio cards come equipped with some lite DAW application such as Cubase LE, Sonar LE, Live Lite, etc which have FX plugins included. That kind of card was what I was looking for originally. Apart from one I found with 4x 1/4" input jacks and 2x optical inputs, I hadn't seen anything close to what I was looking for. Oh, as for the restrictive software, once each track is on the pc, I have a large array of effects at hand from a number of applications I could install to get around that issue. Just getting the split tracks onto the pc and being able to work on them more efficiently is the initial aim... Although if I chose to go portable or live, the Ultralite would be a lot better over a PCI/PCI-E soundcard. I just noticed it's Firewire only as opposed to the 828... bugger.
ChillinBuzz	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 1:12 PM Ouch... And I just saw the Ultralite's price tag!
LiQuidMetamo...	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 1:18 PM Scratch the last comment. M-Audio and EMU provide the cut down SOnar and Cubase but MOTU does not, only audiodesk which is mac only. For decent DAW software on the cheap, then you could consider 1) Reaper - this program is really coming on well and it's cheap but beware that if you want to sell music commercially, the commercial license costs more. http://reaper.fm/ 2)Sonar Home Studio - cut down Sonar but allows multi input recording and 64 audio/midi tracks. http://www.cakewalk.com/Products/HomeStudio/features.asp or you might find the Sonar 6 Studio version on sale at a good price which includes quite a bit extra. 3) Cubase SE3 nice program with a lot of audio and MIDI functionality for around 100 US Dollars *so should be cheaper in UK pounds. You may also find some stores trying to clear out Cubase SL3 and SX3 (with more features) as Cubase 4 has now arrived.
LiQuidMetamo...	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 1:34 PM Yup, those interfaces can be expensive !! The Echo Layla 3G is another PCI card that allows 6 inputs and is quality. Slightly less than the Ultralite here in and the but still a pretty penny. comes with tracktion daw software. http://www.echoaudio.com/Products/PCI/Layla3G/index.php
LiQuidMetamo...	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 1:42 PM http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ECHO-LAYLA-3G-Audio-interface_W0QQitemZ290007366566QQihZ019QQcategoryZ23784QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem this is a good deal on a new one from the UK.
ChillinBuzz	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 3:06 PM Echo Layla 3G looks pretty wicked... but what the heck am i going to use those eight outputs for? it's hooked into a PCI card which means i should be able to take the 6 inputs and record them all at once, which is just what i want... i just dunno if i want to spend the extra on something that has features i may not need... have to think about this.
ChillinBuzz	Date: May 27, 2007 @ 3:24 PM http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/page/shop/flypage/product_id/4732/a/r/e/base £279 inc VAT... not bad, that's £190 cheaper than the Ultralite.
ChillinBuzz	Date: May 28, 2007 @ 4:41 AM I was almost settled on the Audiophile 2496 when I found out it only supported 2 RCA inputs (the other 2 being outputs)... So no good to me again. Here's a question: If the PC/Mac is the recorder and the multitrack application, what on earth would I use all the RCA output sockets for on one of these professional cards? I don't see any point to it at all. What am I missing?
cantillon	Date: May 28, 2007 @ 8:14 AM Outboard gear through a mixing desk, Sir Chillington. I've had an Audiophile for a couple (oops, I'm getting old - I mean several) years and the two inputs are fine for me. Unless you want to record 8 or 16 mikes at once - like a miked up drum kit or live band or some such, you can happily use one for vocal mike and the other for guitar on the wany in. Assuming you want to do "everything inside" a computer, this should be fine. I've even recorded my MIDI gear straight in (which was a six ouput JV and a four output) - all I had to do was set it away, two at a time so to speak, then go back and do it again. I had / have a 16 channel soundcraft mixing desk so I all I did was put the two RCAs (with 1/4" converters) into the relevant sends and press record....usually followed by going and making a cup of tea until the track had finished..... alternatively rolling a joint seemed to work too....heh heh, although I've stopped since then. Possibly because I now do almost everything via one VST or another. I say almost as I've still got the JV... just in case I "need" a sound... although to be honest, I haven't yet.
cantillon	Date: May 28, 2007 @ 8:16 AM RE: your problem Can you SYNC the Fostex via Midi ? If so, you can just record two tracks at a time - a little time consuming perhaps, but it'll save money!

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