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Music, Internet and Artists

thedarkaeons	Date: July 4, 2004 @ 2:21 PM CD's are doomed - let's face it, music-only digital media has no future. The big boys in the music industry are still struggling to figure out what they are going to do and still hate the concept of downloading music. However, despite that, iTunes is a success. This is all fine and good but what about us ARTIST'S? I see lot's of crap in the news about what the impact of downloading has had on the music industry - but what does this all mean to us, especially unsigned and indy acts? I'm interested in thoughts on what the these dramatic changes in the distribution of music will have on artist in the long run? (Please, do not rant about the RIAA or any of that stuff, it's been covered enough on many forums, including this one. Let's talk about the future of musicians.)
andromedascar	Date: July 4, 2004 @ 6:47 PM Iam wondering about this too......
moonslave	Date: July 5, 2004 @ 10:43 PM I believe that in the end, artists will be able to take back the power of the music by JOINING FORCES and using the internet for promotion and distribution. The labels could possibly stick around and popular music, but there will be a significant increase in independent artists who are not seeking to sell a million records, but instead understand how to sell a significantly smaller number of records and still make a larger profit.
Woof	Date: July 5, 2004 @ 11:06 PM I'm glad this topic came up... it's been on my mind for quite a while now. I think there'll always be a handful of commercial artists, who'll be able to move millions of units because they strike some kind of common chord among millions of consumers... but only a handful. For a while, I was thinking film would be a way to go, but unfortunately, the film industry's pretty much gone the way of the recording industry... not much food for thought; just popular escapism like Shrek and Spider-Man. I can't say as I believe anymore, that writing/producing/performing music is a stable career choice for folks. The odds are stacked waaaay to far, in favor of such a career going nowhere. So... where does that leave us? I think we have to consider the medium... cyberspace... and look at what's been (oh I hate this term) POPULAR. From what I've seen, the biggest splash has been made by these folks who put together those audio clips and/or songs that find their way all over the web... the clips that folks email to each other, or that get put up on websites because they've got either a funny, satirical, or socially conscious message. IMHO, if there's a way to become an internet "star", that'd be it (although it's hard to get credit for work that gets so freely exchanged). That means, of course, that there's probably no financial reward for that, and only partial recognition. But I still think it's a good thing. Why? Because it affects people. It makes 'em happy, or makes 'em think, or makes 'em laugh. And that's a gift we still have the ability to give to others with the abilities we've got. Nobody's gonna get rich doing that, but isn't that a decent reward? Knowing you've been responsible for something like that? Music still serves a very important purpose in peoples' lives. It just doesn't serve businesses well anymore, is all.
andromedascar	Date: July 6, 2004 @ 8:35 AM internet I think is istill stuck musicaly speaking in the stone age the medium its pretty underdeveloped by misfortune cause its pretty obvious that here lies the future of music,I have discovered so many independent/unsigned artists that had touched me really deeply,so much talent unnoticed during so many years(censored by riaa and payolas)scary to think about.By the way have seen how many artists own nowadays their own label?thats because of the internet hability to promote themselves,well hanson korn(soon now) natalie merchant simply red tricky and many others sell their their cds by themselves thru internet am I wrong about this?its obvious that industry is a dying dinousar imposing yet but condemned.
thedarkaeons	Date: July 6, 2004 @ 11:10 AM Woof: Being a professional musician has NEVER been a stable career choice. Until the 20th century, musicians were not considered important, in fact they were seen as "low class", much like actors. Entertainers have always been kicked around by society. The recording industry is simply an extension of that mindset.
moonslave	Date: July 6, 2004 @ 1:51 PM How long do you think it will take until new artists are no longer seeking a record deal? I mean, 100% of new artists are independent artists? Too long, as it should happen starting now.
andromedascar	Date: July 6, 2004 @ 9:42 PM moonslave lets say ten years at least I think e-commerce its still begining and thats crux of the matter and bandwidht of course letsgive it ten ears and bbc cnn and mtv will merge i/converge in the same thing,internet will replace tv and that will be the end of music industry as we know it now (as long as internet is free and not some witty tycoon bought it all in some auction )
johnnygnote	Date: July 10, 2004 @ 12:47 AM First of All,, I've been a professional musician for over 35 years and I also have 25 years experience in the computer world. In the last 6 years I've seen dramatic changes happen and the 2 sides of my brain can now operate together. For the first time what I've done for the last 40 to 25 years can now operate togethere. I have the ability to not only create music with my computer with a digital studio I have the ability to produce the artwork refine the sound and upload it all to the internet thereby prodcing my own CD's with out the "middle man" This all must account for something? Gone are the days of having to kiss ass and grovel to A&R people just to record your music and produce it. You can do it all yourself. Isn't that what "Indie" means? To be independent of the system to achieve what you want without the "Man". Bands actually pay 1000$ just to play at the Whiskey Agogo for 30 minutes hoping an A&R person will hear them. I know for myself when someone asks me if I have any CD's I just send them to my website and they can purchase them there, Or I just pay about 5$ a cd and turn them a round for 10$ and I make a 50% profit. I'm not, in it for the money or the fame. I just want the music to be heard. If I make a little cash along the way or if people remember me as that guy who wrote that song or sang that tune, it's just Icing on the Cake. By the way the Internet is not free, we have to pay to use it, we have to buy the computers to get on it, we have to pay the phone companies to use the lines, all in all it seems like it's free but it's not. I say if you're going to put out all that money, make the best of it and use it to it's fullist. We are the new music Indiestry!!!
billhudson	Date: July 10, 2004 @ 9:45 AM damn good ponts Johnny! All very true and it does take a whole lot of work. But for me I am glad I do not have to kiss up to some A&R guy that might not be there next week. Still Pickin' Bill H.
100thmonk	Date: July 10, 2004 @ 10:35 AM the music industry is now being forced into some sort of major changes from the force of this Indiestry. johnny is so right. the playing field has been very uneven for a long time now. the big guys had studios, and equipment that no one could afford to own. now, there are uncountable studios in homes all over the world. as i see it, that makes a much larger number of people who can potentially make music. over time(maybe alot of time as a friend kindly pointed out)this would create a much more educated and interested listenership. people who knew the music they like and could make some music of their own. it just means a more challenging, and exciting world for the songwriter.
Rodrica	Date: July 11, 2004 @ 10:59 AM I agree with Johnny...I have been able to work the whole package myself without the time/expense and aggravation of having to involve a load of other people. I can control what happens to my music, the way it's produced and marketed. The downside however is that this technology, by definition, is open to all and we are saturated by talent...it's still hard to get noticed and sell music - there's even more competition now ranging from someone with a home computer who does it as a hobby, to a professional musician with a full studio set up I think mainly what we all have to decide as individuals is exactly where we want to go with our music...that in itself will tell each of us whether we need to approach the corporates or whether we can handle our own careers It's always been the case that people wouldn't expect to receive building work or plumbing for free, yet they expect a musician or an artist to work for nothing...there's still the assumption that creative pursuits are not "proper jobs". I don't know if we'll ever change that
moonslave	Date: July 11, 2004 @ 12:16 PM I think we need to pull away from the mindframe that "technology is great because I can make music for my own happiness" and move toward "technology is great because I can make a living off my music on my own terms." There is a lot of talent out there, and right now most people who are getting compensted for their talent are doing so through a corrupt, unfair system.
kenlinder	Date: July 24, 2004 @ 1:01 PM http://www.dpi.com.au/catalogue/List.jsp?tier4=794&tier3=231&tier2=71&tier1=7&type= VBM4040 1PK DVD-RAM 5.2GB TYPE 1 $23.53 ---------- http://www.cworld.com.au/prod.php?CAT=Blank%20Media&SUBCAT=DVD 110064 Verbatim Verbatim 5.2GB DVD-RAM DATALIFE+ media $45.00 shipping $15.00 -------- http://www.nasa.com.au/cdrprices_dvd_kodak.html Kodak DVD-RAM 5.2Gb Re-Writable DVD, double sided $33.00 ------ http://www.citynotebookcentre.com.au/cnc$list/pricelist$dec-01_files/dvd_products.htm 10KDVDRAM5.2 KODAK 5.2GB DVD RAM RE-RECORDABLE DVD MEDIA 38.94 http://www.citynotebookcentre.com.au/store/store.php?page=2&cat_id=28 39.75 I look at it this way: those people who do think of others as being defined by their sexual orientation, are actually defining themselves by their sexual orientation; so, the ones who say "if you're not bi, you're cutting yourself off from half of humanity", are actually saying "I consider everyone I meet as a potential sexual partner; it's not about whether I'm attracted to the individual, because I wouldn't accept any limitations on my attraction and/or sexuality, whether gender-related or otherwise". In my experience, many of these people will also not respect limitations like "the person is involved with somebody else", either. Most (decent) people understand and accept that there are, indeed, always limitations to just whom we view as a possible sexual/romantic partner, whether those limitations are gender-related or not. It's like the counterpart to the people who are scared that "if you're gay, you might sexually assault them in the shower", and are actually saying "if someone is the opposite gender, I don't care what they're like as a person, I see them only as a sexual object, and might be willing to sexually assault them to get what I want". In other words, what people say tells you not about yourself, but about them; so, it's important to pay attention to what they say, but only in order to know whether you need to be wary of them, because of how they view others. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder (and the body of the viewed). There is a great bit in the sitcom "just shoot me" where the "better than thou" Mia, is talking to the photographer Elliot. SHe is ranking on him for how bad it is for women to be held up to the image of beauty that fashion mags portray. He says that Michael Angelo's david is a great work of art, Why? Becase of the beauty of that persons physical form. Mia tries to disagree, so he poses like david and pulls up his shirt (with hairy plump belly) as says "How about now?" And no, not everyone needs to meet anyones "physical ideal". I think that models are mutants. I agree with you all that the web and computer technology has put "the studio" into the hands of a lot of people. I also agree that there is a huge sea of music to be found (some really great) an it is ahrd to wade through it, which could be solved in part with a better site design. Before I became too disabed to travel to work, I was a senior computer consultant...abd it COULD be doe a lot better. Anyway it is wonderful to be able to "do it yourself". You can even go to cafe press and not worry about upfront costs on pressing CDs. But...the web cannot compete with the physical worlds distribution chain. We also live in a world with money. Cmputers, software, mixers, mics, web access and instruments cost money. I just spent $100.00 on CD-RAM a CDRW disks. IT adds up. So we are all concerned about the money unless we are somehow well off enough to buy whatever we like. Now in that world "music money" where people get paid, things work in a very specic way. ALmost always a person between 13 and 18 hears a song on the radio (not web radio) or maybe a video...but mostly radio. Then they purhase that CD at a store (usually a chain store). The store gets its CDs from distributors (big companies) who carry stuff fro various established labels. Often they automatically buy everthing in the top 20 in each major genre. No thought really goes into it. Next, And most consumers are lazy creatures of habbit. If it is on the web for free they won't go get it (too much work). If they find it on the web they will not press their own CD (too much work) and would stil rather buy one (good for us) but here is the catch...when you say "internet music" you have immediately cut down the number of people who will see your stuff to less than 1% of the buying public. ANd it gets worse. What is the taget audience for most music sales? Around ages 13 to 18/19. How many of these people can do e-commerce? Not very many. They don't necesarily have bank accounts (to get a paypal account) and rarely have a visa. This puts the "music taret market" in a position where most of them do not know how to buy music off of the web (and might not be able to). They have cash money, not plastic. This is a pain in the butt. But...I think...someday, somewhere, somebody is going to put a "press on demand" machine (complete with color printing on the CD) into a music store, and make a killing selling CD's.
kenlinder	Date: July 24, 2004 @ 1:53 PM That was fucking wierd. I didn't actually say a huge amount of that odd post. None of that stuff on sexual assault was mine. How bloody odd was that. I think I.E. and the web had a total brain hermorage. My apoligies. Wierd!$!@#

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