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Best software for home studio recording.

cdysthe	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 8:56 AM Hi, I play keyboards and want to do some home recording mostly using soft-synths/drums and add some vocal. I have purchased a M-Audio midi controller keyboard and M-Audio speakers in addition to a decent sound card and set my computer up for this kind of job. All I miss is choosing my main work environment/software. I have very little experience with recording/sequencing/looping/producing software, so I will have to learn it from the ground up. I want to spend some time on this, but want to make sure I spend my time wisely. I have had access to Sonar 7 through a friend. It seems to have everything I need in addition to tons I don't. I also seemed quite complicated to use, but not beyond what I can accept having to learn. However, my friend says "there's nothing out there that even comes close to Sonar 7". That may be true, but the question is if I need something as advanced as Sonar 7 at all? If you folks here could recommend software I should try out, or even tell me "get Sonar 7 and go to work" it would be very helpful. //C
Distilled1	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:45 AM I use Krystal and its free. much like pro tools - all the bell also audacity works and is free. I don't sequence but both have the capabilities to a point. I got a these free with my e-mu soundcard cubase (many use that (i cant quite get the learning curve as well as ableton live and sonar something and a cakewalk wave lab. many here seam to use reason and I hear good things about it. the best is not sonar IMHO its protools and logic run together. but anymore for PC it would have to be an old version as logic went MAC only(last I looked)
zedsalt	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 11:30 AM I use Audacity quite a bit and I'm a huge fan, but the version I have won't record MIDI. Maybe newer versions do, but just yesterday, I recorded some MIDI stuff in Cakewalk2003 (which I got for Christmas in '02 and didn't install until a few months ago); converted it to WAV using a really simple, free VSTI host called, simply enough, "VSTI Host"; then imported it into Audacity for editing. It's kind of a bassackwards way of doing it, but all the software I used was free. As far as an intuitive, easy-to-learn interface, though, I haven't seen anything easier than Audacity.
Distilled1	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 11:49 AM krystal was to me zed, but I was used to the interface as it is a clone of pro tools
Thaspian	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 11:56 AM I like Logic.
Distilled1	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 11:57 AM isn't Logic now MAC only updates?
cdysthe	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 1:00 PM Thanks ppls! Some good advice here. One thing I have noticed with Sonar is that it uses advanced driver modes for the sound and is the only one I have tried that doesn't have much latency issues when using soft synths. I do not know how the other solutions mentioned here are in this regard.
leedsquietman	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 4:40 PM This duplicates plenty of other posts. Audacity does not have MIDI. MIDI is the part that costs money, it is much harder to implement a good working MIDI than an audio engine, this is why Kristal and many Linux programs such as Ardour are audio only. People have said for years that Audacity and Ardour will have MIDI developed but no sign of that happening at the moment. Programs such as Protools and Samplitude which started life as audio only programs are still behind in MIDI compared to Cubase, Logic and Sonar which started as MIDI only programs. You should try Reaper, that has a layout a bit like Audacity but has MIDI but it costs 50 bucks for the non commercial license. This duplicates plenty of other posts. On windows, Sonar, Samplitude have demos. I personally love Ableton Live which also has a demo. I grew up on Cubase which is great too but they do not have a demo and I don't recommend using a crack as I have been told that they mostly don't work and have caused serious crashes requiring windows to be reinstalled. There is also Pro Tools, which is OK but ties you to certain hardware and for me has MIDI that is lacking, a very boring GUI and is more restricted than other DAWS feature wise (32 track limit, no plug in delay compensation, etc, etc). If your work doesn't require lots of complex audio or MIDI editing and you use pattern sequencing and loops a lot, then Acid Pro and Fruity Loops are also worth considering. On a Mac, Logic is the obvious choice as it is made by Apple (they took over emagic several years ago), but you can also run ProTools, MOTU Digital Performer, Cubase and Ableton Live on a mac. There is no correct answer, what works for you may not work work for me, etc.
cdysthe	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 5:24 PM Thank you! Again a lot of good advice. I also came over another solution while poking around on the Internet. It's called MU.LAB (www.mutools.com). I downloaded the free version (which only can store 8 tracks), and had a four track song done in about an hour. With Sonar 7 I had to read the manual for an hour before I got to do anything. This program records both midi and sound. It also has a sequencer and some softsynths built in. It's also a VST host, so I tried it with a few VST plug-ins. It worked just fine. Since I am new at this I am wondering what this free program is lacking? I can see that the interface is much simpler than Sonar, but I am not going to do very complex productions with a lot of live recording except for some voice.
leedsquietman	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 7:24 PM It looks OK, the audio and MIDI capabilities are very basic and there are no documents that state what the track limit is for the paid version (8 for the free), no details on how many inserts or sends you can use and the GUI looks very primitive. Most of the expensive paid DAWS have 3 or 4 dozen plugins and 3-4 synths, with sample players. some mastering tools and accept many different file formats for input and output. For something quick and free I guess it works out OK, but I think Reaper is better value for the paid product, has many more effects, more advanced MIDI and routing and a better GUI. Or cut down versions of SOnar and Cubase. Still, can't knock it for free, if you need audio and MIDI for free, so long as your work is sparse or you bounce down tracks. (i.e. mix down 8 tracks to 1 stereo track, import it to a new project and have 7 tracks to work with - this is what the Beatles and co used to do in the days of 4 trck recording, but the downside is that less control can affect the sound quality, mixing, EQing and compression become more difficult to achieve an optimal result on bounced tracks)
cdysthe	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 7:36 PM On 21st Jan 2008, leedsquietman said: It looks OK, the audio and MIDI capabilities are very basic and there are no documents that state what the track limit is for the paid version (8 for the free), no details on how many inserts or sends you can use and the GUI looks very primitive. Most of the expensive paid DAWS have 3 or 4 dozen plugins and 3-4 synths, with sample players. some mastering tools and accept many different file formats for input and output. For something quick and free I guess it works out OK, but I think Reaper is better value for the paid product, has many more effects, more advanced MIDI and routing and a better GUI. Or cut down versions of SOnar and Cubase. Still, can't knock it for free, if you need audio and MIDI for free, so long as your work is sparse or you bounce down tracks. (i.e. mix down 8 tracks to 1 stereo track, import it to a new project and have 7 tracks to work with - this is what the Beatles and co used to do in the days of 4 trck recording, but the downside is that less control can affect the sound quality, mixing, EQing and compression become more difficult to achieve an optimal result on bounced tracks) Thanks again. Seems like I can get Reaper for $50. That's a steal. Getting a full Cakewalk setup would be around $1/2K. However, it doesn't look like Reaper comes with any softsynths built in. That will add to the total cost.
RichLum	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 8:10 PM Reaper does have a basic synth included. There are plenty of free good quality synths and effects available - kvraudio.com is a good source for plugins. I would expect no matter which host you choose you will want to use other plugins than the ones that come with the host. There are so many out there, why limit yourself (although be careful, it can be addictive trying out new plugins all the time and your productivity may suffer...
imemine	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:03 PM On 21st Jan 2008, Distilled1 said: the best is not sonar IMHO its protools and logic run together. WHY OH WHY DO I KEEP COMING BACK TO THIS SONAR BASHING SITE? No one has EVER Offered an answer as to why they don't like it! Distilled---WHY????? I have asked----NO ONE can answer! FACT---If you need MIDI capabilities AND audio----Cakewalk IS the best!---The learning curve isn't that freaking hard! I "YET AGAIN" challenge EVERYONE to tell me WHY "YET AGAIN"...... Cakewalk is SO bad! Drones----GIVE ---ME----A---- FREAKING-----ANSWER! Thank You…..good day!
Israfel	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:05 PM I'm not sure but I think Ime has some strong feelings on this subject.
imemine	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:06 PM Piss Off!
Israfel	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:07 PM I'm just saying...
Mojosnake	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:07 PM just
imemine	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:11 PM ---Mojo---out of here before you get naked!---this is serious dammit!
Mojosnake	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:13 PM naw im getting naked over in the big bird forum.....
imemine	Date: January 21, 2008 @ 10:58 PM Okay----go there!
leedsquietman	Date: January 22, 2008 @ 1:19 AM I agree with you that Sonar has great MIDI and audio capabilities but it's look and workflow don't suit everyone. Me included. If you grew up on Cubase or Logic especially, it's hard to get adjusted, even though Cakewalk have a 'Cubase and Logic' GUI mode that is supposed to act more like those DAWS. I'm sure if I'd used Sonar first I'd be writing about Cubase's GUI being not my cup of tea. Anyway, Ableton Live 7 Suite smokes them all for it's combination of creativity and functionality. The new Logic GUI is vastly improved, that used to give me serious brainache. I just don't like the cramped work on one window concept of Sonar, as for MIDI Cubase is just as good but Sonar 6 and 7 have a full 64 bit audio engine for those rare people running a total 64 bit architecture system whereas Cubase 4.1 and Live 7 have 64 bit mix summing. It's just a look and workflow thing for me, the tools are all there and mighty. I'm not a Sonar basher, I respect it's power even though I don't use it.
Distilled1	Date: January 22, 2008 @ 9:16 AM I am just used to pro tools and Logic. thats all just a IMHO and what I know how to use. Albeton I have and cant get figured out and I have Sonar as well well the free be I just dont understand its UI teach me cause every time I open it I look and say WTF! not bashing just giving my opinion
leedsquietman	Date: January 22, 2008 @ 7:36 PM Follow the video tutorials for Live and you'll be rocking, the session view way of doing things non linear just rocks my world. I can't go back to recording on a linear timeline again, it just sucks the creativity out of me. Live has an amazing GUI once you get used to it, it's not fancy schmancy 3D stuff and session view looks like an Excel window but once you get the bug you won't go back - I sometimes rewire into Cubase because I like Cubase SX's mixer views better but only if I have 24 tracks or more. The new instruments and effects rock in Live 7 Suite too.
independentm...	Date: January 23, 2008 @ 9:23 AM I love and adore Cool Edit 2000 (+ Studio) but Audacity is free and still easily available. (Adobe bought and killed Cool Edit unfortunately)
Thaspian	Date: January 23, 2008 @ 11:53 AM LOGIC!!!!
leedsquietman	Date: January 23, 2008 @ 5:13 PM Logic comes with a dongle - a mac So unless you already have a Mac, then it's an expensive upgrade, even though they slashed the price of Logic Studio 8 to 499, half of what Cubase 4 costs and cheaper than Digital Performer too. ABLETON LIVE 7 SUITE !!!!! (there I got one up on the exclamation marks ) - it's cross platform and more inspirational for creativity.
Mojosnake	Date: January 24, 2008 @ 1:33 AM and logics a pain in the arse to learn had it for like 5 months still havent got anything recorded ...hell i just learned to rewire it to reason...
cantstoprunning	Date: January 24, 2008 @ 2:15 AM I like Audacity, since it's free and easy to use. Good for noobs like myself.
Thaspian	Date: January 24, 2008 @ 5:04 AM that sucks ass. I'm trying to get OSX working on a PC so I can use logic at home. So sucks to have to go to work to work on projects, or export wavs and restart a mix in nuendo at home.
ViciousKitty	Date: January 24, 2008 @ 6:58 AM I use cubase (5.1)Vst 32 and have for many years.The learning curve is as difficult as I want to make it(in Cubase).I think that applies to many PRO softwares meaning the more you want to learn the more tedious it can become.I've also found that there's more simple programs to learn but with that also come certain limitations.For Example I can Run My Cubase with FL 7 as a VST Multi in the background for sequencing samples and drum programing while Using Midi and audio on Cubase simultaneously.I woulnd't be able to do that with Audacity.Ive also found that You tube is a great source of free tutorials when in doubt of any program.I also have Cakewalk,pro tools,Audacity,Adobe audition,Wavelab but I prefer cubase.Anyway thats my two cent in the matter.I would suggest going to you tube or similar info places and get a visual of how to use it and make your choice then.